I'll soon be downloading the trial version of Izotope's "Ozone," the suite of mastering plugins. Izotope recommends bouncing a song down to a stereo file prior to using Ozone. I gather that the stereo file should not be right at 0 db so as to allow for volume changes which may be introduced by Ozone. Any suggestions as to how much room I should allow? Oh, and I've read many times that it is wise to allow others to master one's songs. However, this is just a hobby, so no one's losing any $ over this. Thanks. JEC Logic Express 7.2 MacBook 2G

pfloyd714714 wrote: > I'll soon be downloading the trial version of Izotope's "Ozone," the suite of mastering plugins. > Izotope recommends bouncing a song down to a stereo file prior to using Ozone. I gather > that the stereo file should not be right at 0 db so as to allow for volume changes which may > be introduced by Ozone. Any suggestions as to how much room I should allow? > > Oh, and I've read many times that it is wise to allow others to master one's songs. However, > this is just a hobby, so no one's losing any $ over this. I think it may be worth leaving 1 or 2 dB headroom if your files are 16 bit. If they are 24 bit this is not so much an issue. If you want to leave headroom the ideal amount would be the amount by which you raise the level in mastering, so you either need a crystal ball or you could master, save settings and then remix to allow for the exact amount. But if you did that you might as well just add the mastering processing in the mix. -- Pete Thomas www.petethomas.co.uk Logic Tutorials, Hints, Tips, free Icons, Environments EXS Instruments (donationware) ***Please support my trek in the Andes in aid of APEC*** ***info & sponsorship: http://www.justgiving.com/petethomas***

On 01.10.2006, at 10:52, Pete Thomas wrote: > If you want to leave headroom the ideal amount would be the amount by > which you raise the level in mastering, so you either need a crystal > ball or you could master, save settings and then remix to allow for > the > exact amount. In case of external mastering: what for is the crystal ball? Although I like these analog devices ;-) why not just leave enough, 3 dB or more? I guess the mastering engineer has a volume fader and he can be told to make the piece loud or only increase dynamics or whatever is expected. ___ Peter Ostry

Peter Ostry wrote: > On 01.10.2006, at 10:52, Pete Thomas wrote: > >> If you want to leave headroom the ideal amount would be the amount by >> which you raise the level in mastering, so you either need a crystal >> ball or you could master, save settings and then remix to allow for >> the >> exact amount. > > In case of external mastering: what for is the crystal ball? True, but the OP is discussing mastering their own stuff. If it's going to an external mastering studio though I would use Crystal Ball, my favourite plugin (Intel version out soon I've heard) Although > I like these analog devices ;-) why not just leave enough, 3 dB or > more? I guess the mastering engineer has a volume fader and he can be > told to make the piece loud or only increase dynamics or whatever is > expected. I used to leave 2 -3 dB, but the mastering engineer I use now says not to bother. -- Pete Thomas www.petethomas.co.uk Logic Tutorials, Hints, Tips, free Icons, Environments EXS Instruments (donationware) ***Please support my trek in the Andes in aid of APEC*** ***info & sponsorship: http://www.justgiving.com/petethomas***

On 01.10.2006, at 22:48, Pete Thomas wrote: > I used to leave 2 -3 dB, but the mastering engineer I use now says not > to bother. I can think of two reasons: He finally got a compressor ;-) or your mixes are so good that he does just finetuning (I suspect that is the case). ___ Peter Ostry

On Oct 2, 2006, at 6:36 AM, Peter Ostry wrote: > On 01.10.2006, at 22:48, Pete Thomas wrote: > >> I used to leave 2 -3 dB, but the mastering engineer I use now says >> not >> to bother. > > I can think of two reasons: > He finally got a compressor ;-) You mean he finally got an input gain knob? I have always found it totally nonsensical when people say you have to leave XX amount of head room for the mastering guy. He can turn up or down the input to his processors just like anybody else.

> You mean he finally got an input gain knob? > > I have always found it totally nonsensical when people say you have > to leave XX amount of head room for the mastering guy. > > He can turn up or down the input to his processors just like anybody > else. Maybe in old style etiquette, leaving some headroom is a gesture to show you didn't limit or clip your file against 0 db. Of course nowadays you could brickwall limit your mix to -3db, but in theory you're not sending a brickwall-limited mix to a mastering engineer. Right? Right fellas?!

> Maybe in old style etiquette, leaving some headroom is a gesture to > show you didn't limit > or clip your file against 0 db. Of course nowadays you could > brickwall limit your mix to > -3db, but in theory you're not sending a brickwall-limited mix to a > mastering engineer. > Right? Right fellas?! Not only in theory; mastering engineers want the supplied material to be as little compressed/limited as possible. The more you compress/ limit it, the less the mastering engineer can do for you. So the only headroom required is the headroom you need yourself to get a mix that isn't either squashed or clipped. Maurits.

>>> I used to leave 2 -3 dB, but the mastering engineer I use now says >>> not to bother. >> >> I can think of two reasons: >> He finally got a compressor ;-) > > You mean he finally got an input gain knob? > > I have always found it totally nonsensical when people say you have > to leave XX amount of head room for the mastering guy. > > He can turn up or down the input to his processors just like anybody > else. > The problem is when you have overloads and whole mixes that are flat- topped. I see this all the time. If people were using sensible levels and Logic's meters weren't scaled so weirdly, this would not be an issue. For comparison, the level out of the average analog console to tape is about -18 to -12 dBfs. Mars PS - Google "Bob Katz K14 Metering" when you get a chance...

On Oct 4, 2006, at 3:46 AM, Mars wrote: > >>>> I used to leave 2 -3 dB, but the mastering engineer I use now says >>>> not to bother. >>> >>> I can think of two reasons: >>> He finally got a compressor ;-) >> >> You mean he finally got an input gain knob? >> >> I have always found it totally nonsensical when people say you have >> to leave XX amount of head room for the mastering guy. >> >> He can turn up or down the input to his processors just like anybody >> else. >> > > The problem is when you have overloads and whole mixes that are flat- > topped. That is a different issue. If you don't want people to give you files with overloads what you should say is "don't clip the outputs". This "Leave some over head for the mastering guy" is bullshit if that is all it is referring to. It's like saying "don't drive your car on the road by the sea" when all you really mean is "don't drive your car off the cliff into the ocean". > I see this all the time. That is *their* careless behavior, no reason to counter it with imprecise language. > If people were using sensible levels > and Logic's meters weren't scaled so weirdly, this would not be an > issue. For comparison, the level out of the average analog console to > tape is about -18 to -12 dBfs. You get no argument from me about logic's meters they are past due for an overhaul.