In a message dated 11/2/04 11:47:16 AM, logic-users@yahoogroups.com writes: > James Ryan <jeryan@...> writes: > >I find Ivory just a little to bright, brittle and slightly thin.  > >Probably great for pop and rock tracks, but not so great > >for soundtrack and classical scoring. > You must be kidding... wow... I dont see that but as they say-to each his own. I would recommend actually PLAYING the piano samples since there is so much more than just LISTENING to the samples. The way the individual samples FEEL and REACT to your individual touch is just as important as theRAW sample itself. -Terry Michael Huud www.Music4TheMovies.com

> > >I find Ivory just a little to bright, brittle and slightly thin.  > > >Probably great for pop and rock tracks, but not so great > > >for soundtrack and classical scoring. > You must be kidding... wow... I dont see that but as they say-to > each his own. I'm surprised by that appraisal as well. My impression of Ivory is pretty much the opposite, good for classical and soundtrack, perhaps too 'soft' for rock, although the C7 may cut through denser mixes. My complaint about the Ivory samples is they're a bit too close, too dry. It seems a shame to have recorded such beautiful instruments so well, and not included a mixable layer of ambience from a great room. u b i k

>>>> I find Ivory just a little to bright, brittle and slightly thin.  >>>> Probably great for pop and rock tracks, but not so great >>>> for soundtrack and classical scoring. > >> You must be kidding... wow... I dont see that but as they say-to >> each his own. > > > I'm surprised by that appraisal as well. My impression of Ivory is pretty > much the opposite, good for classical and soundtrack, perhaps too 'soft' for > rock, although the C7 may cut through denser mixes. > > My complaint about the Ivory samples is they're a bit too close, too dry.It > seems a shame to have recorded such beautiful instruments so well, and not > included a mixable layer of ambience from a great room. > > > u b i k That's what I was talking about in my above comment. For classical music in my experience, close miking is exactly what most classical pianists don't want. I actually had one come into my studio to record with my real Steinway, and while I was miking it, he said "what are you doing? Those mikes are too close, I hate that sound. Put them much farther back so the piano can breathe." I was only guessing at Ivory being better for rock, based on the dryness you're referring to, as in that instance, close miking is the standard. Only trying it in a track or two will tell the real story and for that, we will have to rely on reports from those who decide to purchase it. This is not a terrific area for debate, as it is pretty subjective. I was only giving it my personal review based on the MP3 demos. Sorry if I offended anybody's esthetic sense of what a good piano should sound like and how it should be used. :) James

On Nov 3, 2004, at 16:47, James Ryan wrote: > I was only guessing at Ivory being better for rock, based on the dryness > you're referring to, as in that instance, close miking is the standard. Is it not possible to sample a piano like i.e. the Mixtended Drums? They have three sets called direct, room and overhead which you can mix. For a piano this would probably be a close position, the "thumb rule" of once the maximum width of the resonating body (which might be too far for a piano) and room mics. Or a special room - maybe we should ask Mr. Tucmandl (VSL) if they plan to sample a piano on their "silent stage". Must be pretty hard to do otherwise it would already be here. I dropped a mail there. Peter Ostry

>> I was only guessing at Ivory being better for rock, based on the dryness >> you're referring to, as in that instance, close miking is the standard. > > Is it not possible to sample a piano like i.e. the Mixtended Drums? > They have three sets called direct, room and overhead which you can > mix. For a piano this would probably be a close position, the "thumb > rule" of once the maximum width of the resonating body (which might be > too far for a piano) and room mics. > > Or a special room - maybe we should ask Mr. Tucmandl (VSL) if they plan > to sample a piano on their "silent stage". Must be pretty hard to do > otherwise it would already be here. I dropped a mail there. > > > Peter Ostry Post Piano ships a bunch of IRs for Space Designer with their Emperor Bosendorfer that aren't bad for this application. They're basically small rooms to add some ambience. Not quite distance miking, but better than right on the strings. (don't scream! I mean for classical recordings) I do agree though, that the Mixtended concept is a good one. The only problem might be the size. To have three complete sets of gigantic piano samples running concurrently might choke even the EXS with streaming enabled. Isn't Ivory supposed to be able to dial in a mike distance effect? I noticed that there is a stereo perspective switch you can select with the option of Performer or Audience. Anybody tried this? Does it simulate distance or just narrow the stereo spread? James

> Isn't Ivory supposed to be able to dial in a mike distance effect? I > noticed that there is a stereo perspective switch you can select with the > option of Performer or Audience. Anybody tried this? Does it simulate > distance or just narrow the stereo spread? I saw that too and wondered. My assumption was that, based on the terminology, it reverses the left-right perspective. IOW, a player's perspective is lower pitches left, higher pitches right, and an audience member's would be... reversed? Technically, a typical audience perspective would more likely be lower pitches farther, higher pitches closer, but I imagine that's not what they did. Anyway, those are all assumptions, and we know what those are worth ; ) u b i k

On Nov 4, 2004, at 09:11, u b i k wrote: > My assumption was that, based on the > terminology, it reverses the left-right perspective. IOW, a player's > perspective is lower pitches left, higher pitches right, and an > audience member's would be... reversed? Technically, a typical > audience perspective would more likely be lower pitches farther, > higher pitches closer, but I imagine that's not what they did. For me the sounds of a virtual instrument should be orientated like a player hears the real thing. This is best for a playing musician and in the mix you can change it anyway. Peter Ostry