I'm seriously doubting my intelligence on this one, but only one side of my brain is working right now... I'm writing cues for a 15min short (about 10 cues in all) and I decided to try the "open movie" option and write all my sections in one, continuous document. Seemed rational at the time — create a palette of instruments/sounds/effects and treat the the project as a whole. "Open Movie..." worked fine; first cue was written; what a joy. I set a slew of markers to spot the film and proceeded to attack the second cue, realising that this one wanted/needed a tempo change from the first. No problem, created the tempo change, but now everything's out of whack from that point on. And I'm lost. I wish I had a better math brain, but I just don't. Can I not create tempo events in a song that has a movie 'embedded' in it without messing everything up (markers etc.) Do I have to manually adjust marker positions (and thus every related object) everytime I adjust a preceeding tempo event? My head is spinning. Perhaps everyone else writes their cues one-to-a-logic-song? As opposed to building a continuous, linear string of cues in one document? But that seems cumbersome and un-logic-like. Any advice would be genuinly appreciated and replied to. To summarize: One, continuous movie, needing ten cues, all at different tempos. How? Many thanks.

> I wish I had a better math brain, but I just don't. Can I not create tempo > events in a song that has a movie 'embedded' in it without messing everything > up (markers etc.) > > Do I have to manually adjust marker positions (and thus every related object) > everytime I adjust a preceeding tempo event? > > My head is spinning. > > Perhaps everyone else writes their cues one-to-a-logic-song? As opposed to > building a continuous, linear string of cues in one document? But that seems cumbersome and un-logic-like. > > Any advice would be genuinly appreciated and replied to. > > To summarize: > One, continuous movie, needing ten cues, all at different tempos. How? > > Many thanks. I'm one of those who creates a new song for each cue. Partially for the reasons you mention, but also because I just prefer to be able to open a single cue when it needs revisions. I also tend to create multiple versions of a cue, so I actually have a seperate folder for each. To play back the movie as a continuous mix for the director, I always have a song which only includes the mixed cues as audio files, each placed at the correct time code for a 'press play - watch the whole thing' experience. I can even stack my various versions on seperate tracks for a lightning quick "mute/unmute - here's a variation on that, Mr. Director." (They LIKE choices.) You can accomplish you want by inserting what I call a 'correction' tempo entry. For example, all your cues are in sync, then they add some time to a scene and suddenly the next cue after that scene - and every cue following - is out of sync. I simply find a random point in the silent space and insert a tempo entry that corrects this. Then every cue from that point is back in sync. You can do this as many times as you need to keep subsequent cues starting on the right frame. Hope this helps. Fred Story

> Can I not create tempo events in a song that has a > movie 'embedded' in it without messing > everything > up (markers etc.) You sort of can, when you SMPTE lock everything downstream. You'd have to do this separately for markers, for arrangement objects (sequences and regions) and for automation. You would also have to convert any delay plugins from tempo matched to fixed, and you'd have to come up with something very clever, should tempo synced things in an external MIDI device be involved. Of course you would have to go through the entire unlock/lock procedure for each event type should you decide (or be requested) to change anything. However, you'd forever lose any relation of bars and beats to the fixed events, cause the time had been slipped underneath. So no more quantizing afterwards and don't even think about printing a score. Or write your music in one song per cue. Christian [URL=http://www.artofthegroove.com/logic/mp3/Christian_Obermaier_demo.mp3]sh ow reel [/URL] [URL=http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/home.htm]home page [/URL] [URL=http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/Studio.htm]studio pics [/URL] [URL=http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/Gearlist.htm]gear list [/URL] ====homepage http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/home.htm Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Hey Fred, good to see you over here. > You can accomplish you want by inserting what I call a 'correction' tempo entry. I use this a lot too, when going from wild tempo to fixed while hitting a spot. Or when two adjacent cues *do* happen in one song. I have made it a habit to hit the right tempo at least one bar prior to the actual spot. Makes it a bit more complicated to calculate in the tempo list, but it avoids hitting your string section with a countin at tempo 2132.265 bpm ;o) How do you handle this ? Christian ====homepage http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/home.htm

Fred and Christian, Thank you so much for your considered replies. Fascinating. I spent most of last night experimenting with this locking to SMPTE of every component, including markers, to see how feasible it was — the idea of a continuous composing canvas still appeals — but taking your combined comments to heart I can see how it's possible, but fraught with gotchas... Fred, your suggestion of building a separate, complete arrangement using the bounced audios of the cues is excellent and seems the way to go — especially as it does allow the auditioning of alt cues and start points on the fly. I guess one of the reasons I was trying to make the 'single song' approach work is that I rely almost exclusively on software instuments (Stylus, atmosphere, EXS24 etc) for my sound sources and switching between cues is such a tiresome process... A new G5 would help, but I feel myself gravitating towards getting a GigaStudio setup and keeping most of my tracks as midi only. (Oh, for a Mac version of Giga...) I'm not new to Logic, but pretty new to working with film, so your replies have really helped. Thanks.

> building a separate, complete arrangement > using the bounced audios of the cues is excellent Note that this is also the way to go for OMF export, since you can then easily transfer this very arrangement to the dubbing stage for final mixing. And it will all show up just fine, since the Master song does not contain any tempo/meter changes, no plugins or other gadgets that might get messed up on the way out. Christian ====homepage http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/home.htm ____________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/download/index.html

> Note that this is also the way to go for OMF export, since you can then > easily transfer this very arrangement to the dubbing stage for final > mixing. And it will all show up just fine, since the Master song does > not contain any tempo/meter changes, no plugins or other gadgets that > might get messed up on the way out. Of course; makes more and more sense. Thanks.