I have posted many times asking how to get those 'soft crisp modern reggae hihats' referring to samples played by MPC's in modern reggae production. Soft hihat sounds are common in all dance music. Well I have made progress by high pass filtering everything below 7Khz to get the reggae dancehall hihat sound but the stick hit attack was still there. Using Logics compressor to limit a few Db from the sample in theory would soften the attack. But in practise it didn't get rid of the sharp attack sound. I downloded the waves plug ins VST demo versions. I tryed out the REQ. Then the REN Compressor. Setting the compressor to the exact same settings as the Logic compressor eg Zero attack, 10 Ratio and reduce the threshold to squash it by 4-6Db. Voila! The waves REN Comp made the stick hit sound disappear. I auditioned all my drum machine hihat samples through this channel processing and suddenly I had 100's of beautiful modern reggae hihats. I don't know if this is what the Jamaicans do to get they're hihats sounding soft and crisp but many of the drum machine hihats with this processing revealed themselves to be exactly the classic reggae hihats I have been looking for especially the drumtrax closed and open hihat, S3 hihats and the DR550. Why does Logics compressor set to the same settings let the attack through so you can hear the stick hit sound whereas the waves Renaissance compressor does what you'd expect and squashes the attack when set to zero? Once again HUGE DIFFERENCE. Try this comparison out for yourself. It exposes Logics compressors as ineffective and not doing what the settings claim they are doing. Anyone agree with me?

"roman pirie" <romanp@...> wrote: > Why does Logics compressor set to the same settings let the attack through > so you can hear the stick hit sound whereas the waves Renaissance compressor > does what you'd expect and squashes the attack when set to zero? > > Once again HUGE DIFFERENCE. Try this comparison out for yourself. > It exposes Logics compressors as ineffective and not doing what the settings > claim they are doing. > Anyone agree with me? No. The two compressors have different design decisions made for them, and consequently sound and behave very differently. Just because the attack says "0" diesn't mean both have an instant attack. They will respond differently, according to their processing algorthms. I find Logic's compressor quite hard, whereas the Ren Comp is much software and warmer - much better for vocals and bvox, guitars and actually I prefer it for most things. In fact, Digital Village are doing the Ren Collection 1 & 2 for a really good price. If you like 'em, and they do what you want, buy 'em... Ben Hall www.benhall.co.uk

> Once again HUGE DIFFERENCE. Try this comparison out for yourself. > It exposes Logics compressors as ineffective and not doing what the > settings claim they are doing. > Anyone agree with me? You seem to have a wrong understanding what "Attack" means regarding a compressor. It describes the time the compressor needs to react (attenuate) as soon as the threshold level of the input or sidechain signal is exceeded. I don´t really understand how the REN Comp would kill the attacks ofyour hi hats, it´s more likely that they don´t show up that much because they are lowered by a fast attack time and a low fairly low threshold. I don´t think the logic compressor renders to uselessness only because you cannot get a special sound out of it. I know it sounds way different compared to REN Compressor. That´s why there are different compressors out there and that´s why I use different compressors in my mixes. Cheers Muhammed

> Why does Logics compressor set to the same settings let the attack through > so you can hear the stick hit sound whereas the waves Renaissance compressor > does what you'd expect and squashes the attack when set to zero? > > Once again HUGE DIFFERENCE. Try this comparison out for yourself. > It exposes Logics compressors as ineffective and not doing what the settings > claim they are doing. > Anyone agree with me? Oh man..... why do you think there are 400 different hardware and software compressors out in the world? Compressors, like mics, all sound different. that's why people collect them in droves, for their character. I use the logic compressors intensely, they are a good at keeping a track in check and still sound good when pushed hard. But being that the RenComp IS very nice that still doesn't make everything else you've been using useless and ineffective. You'll find a place where the logic compressor will be perfect, just like you did with your HHs. Giotto

> Why does Logics compressor set to the same settings let the attack through > so you can hear the stick hit sound whereas the waves Renaissance compressor > does what you'd expect and squashes the attack when set to zero? > > Once again HUGE DIFFERENCE. Try this comparison out for yourself. > It exposes Logics compressors as ineffective and not doing what the settings > claim they are doing. > Anyone agree with me? Buy two super expensive outboard valve compressors (possibly even the same model by the same manufacturer!) and set them up identically and there is a good chance they will sound different. Which ever one you decide to throw away because it's "ineffective and not doing what the settings claim they are doing", please can I have it? I'll make good use of it! Gareth (who loves his real Drawmer 1960 as much as his Waves Ren stuff and his TC Powercore 24/7 but perhaps not as much as his UAD-1 stuff - they all work and they all have their uses)

>> Once again HUGE DIFFERENCE. Try this comparison out for yourself. >> It exposes Logics compressors as ineffective and not doing what the >> settings claim they are doing. >> Anyone agree with me? > You seem to have a wrong understanding what "Attack" means regarding a > compressor. It describes the time the compressor needs to react (attenuate) > as soon as the threshold level of the input or sidechain signal is exceeded. Yes, I understand this perfectly. > I don´t really understand how the REN Comp would kill the attacks ofyour hi > hats, it´s more likely that they don´t show up that much because theyare > lowered by a fast attack time and a low fairly low threshold. I don´t thinkI didn't explain myself clearly. The effect I was after was to minimise the sound of the attack on unprocessed hihat samples. To do this you have to 'limit' or compress quite hard say ratio 10 and up, with the lowest attack setting to squash down that initial attack. Because the attack is the highest amplitude in the sound, you only need to reduce it by a few Db eg 3-6 to get the soft sound. This resulted in the hihat sound I have been after for years, when, I used the REN Compressor! I have tryed many times with Logics compressor to limit the inital attack, squash it down a bit, but even with zero attack and high ratios the attack of the sound DOES NOT get limited. Logics compressor does not respond quickly. Even with the attack at zero it lets through more attack than the attack parameter claims. This is what I have discovered and thought it was interesting. IMHO it makes the parameter inaccurate. Maybe the real response time should be given on the Compressors parameters. IMHO waves renaissance compressor attack parameter reads and acts accurately. This for me is a discovery, a good one. On an emotional note, I too have used Logics compressors and made music that made me happy. > the logic compressor renders to uselessness only because you cannot get a > special sound out of it. I know it sounds way different compared to REN > Compressor. That´s why there are different compressors out there and that´s > why I use different compressors in my mixes. > > Cheers > Muhammed